Editing Talk:List of Useful Tools

==Biased?==
<blockquote>''"(( The NeoDex does not endorse the following program, its creators, or what it will allow you to accomplish on Neopets. This is merely here for historical purposes, and nothing more. --Jacob 19:01, 17 Apr 2006 (CDT) ))"''</blockquote>I don't feel this is fair to the project. Why not have this at the top of the page instead of attached to only the ImproveNeo project. Unless you are implying you [i]do[/i] endorse all the others. --[[User:Littlemac|Littlemac]] 22:41, 14 Aug 2006 (CDT)

:Ditto with this...<blockquote>''"Until more word is brought forth on how Neopets feels about this, use of the program should be held with caution."''</blockquote>That's clearly biased, against the use of the ImproveNeo project. None of the programs here have been endorsed by Neopets. Again, why not put this at the top of the page. ImproveNeo is no more risky than any other program. --[[User:Littlemac|Littlemac]] 22:44, 14 Aug 2006 (CDT)

Littlemac? My apologies for not getting to this right away. you are right, it is biased, and should be changed in accordance with being fair. i created it as such in the past because i was being overly paranoid, seeing a page of a program i knew so little of, with the information that it was controversial in what it could. but yes, this should be changed, because all programs outside of neopets are to be used at a users own risk, and ImproveNeo is no different, right?

:Btw, i noticed you have joined up with [[NeoItems.net]]. I think this is fascinating, as neoitems is praised as being the best of the best (or at least that i know of). I congradulate you. I also "favorited" your youtube movie on showing ImproveNeo in action (at least i think that was you). :) --[[User:Jacob|Jacob]] 23:43, 14 Aug 2006 (CDT)

Well, considering it is still in dispute how far ImproveNeo contradicts the terms and conditions, while it is pretty much cert that the others don't, I don't see there being a problem with commenting on how it is controversial... --[[User:Macbeth|Macbeth]] 05:50, 15 Aug 2006 (CDT)

:Yes, we have partnered with NeoItems.net. I truly can't say enough good things about them. They are awesome people, and great to work with. And, yes, that YouTube movie was my me.[[User:Littlemac|Littlemac]] 16:48, 17 Aug 2006 (CDT)

::''(this next part is directed at Macbeth, but for some reason is under the first response. --[[User:Jacob|Jacob]] 19:04, 4 Feb 2007 (CST))'' I disagree. It is true that it may go against the T&C, but the others may too. Specifically the IDB Toolar. Even Neodaq/shop.xls probaly go against the T&C. Unless you want to put the statement on all of those, I think a sentence reading, "Some of these programs may be against the Neopets Terms & Conditions (link). Use at your own risk." put at the top of the page is sufficient. [[User:Littlemac|Littlemac]] 16:49, 17 Aug 2006 (CDT)

The IDB Toolbar does not violate the T&C... It allows you to search the IDB, which is not part of Neopets.com, and links to areas on Neopets.com.... And Neodaq's .XLS tool does not interfere with the game at all, it is the same as you writing down your stock prices on a peice of paper, effectively. It does not tell you what to do, or do it for you... It just reads...

You say you disagree with me when I say I think there should be a note saying the ImproveNeo is controvesial, but you don't propose to do anything different to what I do... 

Although, as the Neodex should be as detailed as possible, it would be logical to be specific in refering to which tools are in dispute as to whether they violate the T&C or not. --[[User:Macbeth|Macbeth]] 18:04, 17 Aug 2006 (CDT)

:The IDB Toolar also allows you to search the shopwiz from it, therefore allowing you to perform certain actions faster. If ImproveNeo is breaking the T&C, I can see no way that IDB is not.<blockquote>''"And Neodaq's .XLS tool does not interfere with the game at all, it is the same as you writing down your stock prices on a peice of paper, effectively. It does not tell you what to do, or do it for you... It just reads..."''</blockquote> Firstly, ImproveNeo does nothing 'for you' either. Secondly, Neodaq.xls does provide buy recommendations to you. Apologies, I didn't disagree with you on the controversial point, but on the T&C point. Thanks, mac --[[User:Littlemac|Littlemac]] 19:54, 18 Aug 2006 (CDT)

I see your points... Jacob's latest edit, I think, is much more neutral, though. I don't see any problem with the current phraseology. --[[User:Macbeth|Macbeth]] 17:09, 24 Aug 2006 (CDT)

==Current events==
As stated in the [[Talk:ImproveNeo|ImproveNeo]] talk page, i'm cleaning up conversations as much as i can, and mentioning current events. Will now wait to see what will come of this. --[[User:Jacob|Jacob]] 19:04, 4 Feb 2007 (CST)
:alright, i'm a little late on it, but i'm finally putting the data here.
----

::[http://www.improveneo.com ImproveNeo] began as a [[Wikipedia:Greasemonkey|Greasemonkey]] script being developed by [[User:Littlemac|Littlemac]] from the [[NeoDaq]] forums. With the script, users can remove ads, have stocks recommended to them, dynamically look-up [[Shop Wizard]] prices, have the script alert them to under-priced items, and hide user's [[shop]] descriptions so as to make buying items easier. On ''(need date)'', ImproveNeo joined up with the item database of [[NeoItems.net]], adding a new dimesion to searching for items by adding price listings.

::The first version of the script, 0.1, was released to the general public on February 19, 2006. Since then, it has been updated many times, with 0.8.3 being the latest version. Because of the features ImproveNeo provides, the legality of the program is debatable, and should be used with caution.
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::[http://userscripts.org/scripts/show/3171 NeoHax] (also known as ''NeopetsFix'') is a Greasemonkey script that does the following.
::*Adds links to a users [[guild]], shop, and [[petpages]] to the sidebar.
::*Adds an [[inventory]] button that shows an altered version of the inventry page in a pop up (Only shows item images, no [[sidebar]])
::*Shows the [[Jelly World]] forum on the [[NeoBoard]]s
::*Lets a user change your [[Avatar]] from the [[SHH]]
::*Lets a user turn off fonts.
::*Lets a user enter custom interests on their [[User Lookup]].
::*Disables [[NeoMail]] (A Glitch, must disable Greasemonkey to use Neomail again)
----

:greasemonkey scripts became banned sometime at the end of January, and those using ImproveNeo had their Shop Wizard list altered by have the top 5 listings removed. due to an [http://www.neopets.com/ntimes/index.phtml?section=editorial&issue=277 editorial] coming out around the same time, it's believed greasemonkey scripts, or at least those which change the experience of the game, are illegal, and will get you frozen.

:Both of these programs seem to fall under those lines. now is the problem of how to present this in the article, as it's a big deal in my belief. how shall this be presented? discuss. --[[User:Jacob|Jacob]] 13:26, 28 Mar 2007 (CST)

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