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 Post subject: Price Gauging
PostPosted: Mon Jan 17, 2005 9:48 pm 
PPT Warrior
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There is major price gauging going on here in this game.

I say this because out of all the times I've tried to do Taelia's Quests, I've only managed to do 1 since here return. ONE!

I can't even do Edna's or Kitchen anymore because of this. All three request the same items it seems.

But this is all because of the "players" gauging the prices on the players. By this I mean people who only restock and do not keep prices fair. While we, the true players who play games and stockmarket (among other things, IE quests), can't afford any of this while the restockers can. Maybe you are a one of these "players" and are taking advantage of this? But of course fewer Restocks doesn't help this situation either does it?

I've mailed Donna through Editorial, mailed both Idea/Suggestions and the other as well. This has started to ruin the game in so many ways it is outrageous to all of it's true players.

Does anyone else feel the same way about this?

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*Note to mods: I'm not trying to make this sound like a Gloat/Cry thing at all, that's for another thread. This is my opinion. But as you all have likely noticed while playing the game, this is going on and I would like to hear others opinions on this.
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 17, 2005 10:00 pm 
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Shop owners will charge what people will pay. Users aren't being gouged - there's no united movement of chocolate resellers, for example. Demand is high because people want to do the snow faerie quests, and aren't willing to think things through to do it.

Prices are high because people want the avatar, and want the ice cream tickets, and want the giveaway items. I can't explain it, other than to say that you're right - for the most part, these quests aren't worth it.

Eventually, prices for snowfaerie quest items will drop down more. I've seen lots of chocolate shop item prices plummet the last week (that being a relative term, they're still expensive). But it's not gouging - just demand.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 17, 2005 10:03 pm 
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I don't really have the computer speed to restock, but I snipe a lot. I think that buying low and selling high is also a form of Neopian game playing and is just as valid as the stockmarket or game playing (which is where I make the most of my money).

What I find to be unfair is when large groups of people conspire together to purchase cheaply and inflate the price of a certain item. Also, offer up for trade an item at much ower prices, with no intention to sell, to drive down the asking price from people not in thier group.


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 Post subject: ...
PostPosted: Mon Jan 17, 2005 10:10 pm 
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Either way you look at it, it shouldn't be going on.

Now I am, and always have, been willing to pay say a total of 5000 Np for a Kitchen/Snow Quest, knowing fare well that I Stood a chance of getting back nearly none of that in Pt's, could get a Snowball ontop of my second snowball.

It is just outright outrageous for all of this. Earlier, I was gonna do a Edna quest, for what I thought, 200 Np. So I went to the shopwizard for the chocolate, and it's like 18,000 NP!!! Same with Snow. I already had the first two items, the second I thought might of been 2500/3000 np's, instead it too was 18,000 Np.

TNT has one of two things to do here-

1. Put us back to where a large sum of the Rairty Items where orignally and increase the restocks again.

2. Cap all items on a certain price expect Retired and Hidden Tower.

Players aren't having fun anymore because this isn't a game to 95% of it's "players".


I don't mind snipe. It's ok to buy a 500NP item and try to sell it for 750Np. That is like STockmarketing in the way, just instant in it's own means. I also agree with you on the "Group" thing and the Trade thing that goes on. It is unfair to the players involved.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jan 17, 2005 10:17 pm 
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I -AM- a restocker.

I am proud of the fact I know what to buy if I can get it in the shops I restock in. I see no reason why I should not charge what I want to charge for what I get. Why should I not make the most I possible can? I will sometimes sell a few hundred maybe even a thousand or so points under the shop wiz prices for a fast sell but I sure as heck isnt gonna sell something I can make massive points on cheap for someone else to make my profit.

If you dont like what they ask for then dont do the qwuest is my most kind and honest advice I'd actually rarely do them I wait for the cheap ones.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jan 17, 2005 10:28 pm 
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And that's all you do is it not? Just restock?

That is one of the problems I, and many others, have. There are "players" and then players. This is a game. You are supposed to do a great deal to earn your keep and keep it. The "Players" don't seem to realize this and only restock, sell high (gauging in most items anymore) and repeat.

With Quests, I have tried to do roughly 30 Taelia quests since her return 3 weeks ago. Since then, like stated above, I've only managed to do One. One. If it was Pre-Taelia (Gauging) Time, I would have been able to do Two-Thirds of her quests alone if I was willing too. Usually I didn't and tried to spend 3k or less, but once and a while was always willing to spend 5k or less.

But I, like many other players, can't because the "Players" have the prices to high for the players. Thus 90% of them can afford their fellow "players" items and get a good amount of items, while the players can not afford left or right.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jan 17, 2005 10:30 pm 
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In prices "greed" and "price gouging" do not exist. Prices are simply a function of supply and demand. Shop owners aren't charging an unreasonable amount for items - - it's the price the market will bear. As soon as demand for the items go down, peoples personal resources will be reallocated to different ventures and prices will drop on quest items accordingly.

I only restock and I take offense to how you phrase that. I'm doing nothing but using the one skill I do have (I'm lousy at games) to make np. It's not my fault I can sell for high prices. If I do decide to sell lower, it would not make one ounce of difference because I'm 95% sure someone else would make the profit I missed out on by buying my item and reselling it. I see it all the time with polarchucks. On one day in particular I restocked 10 and set the price only 250np lower than the going price. Upon checking my shop history the same person bought all 10 and were selling them for 250np more than I had. Why should I do the work restocking and let someone else take part of my profit?

A cap on item price is extremely unrealistic. Setting a price celing would make the problem about a million times worse. Think rent control in NYC. Lower prices=increased demand. This would lead to a shortage of items. Instead of going to the wiz and finding hundreds of stores with the quest item in stock, chances are you'd find none. Increasing the amount that is stocked wouldn't help this one bit unless you increased the stock to the point where supply=demand at whatever artificial price you want it set at, making the price cap unnecessary and redundant. A stocking boost by itself might relieve a teensy bit of the high prices, but a signifigant amount more would have to stock to make any real difference.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jan 17, 2005 10:40 pm 
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Anyone has the option to restock. If you want to earn more np, that's what you have to do, because playing games doesn't offer anywhere near the same amount of revenue. Don't condemn the people who DO do it, there's nothing wrong with it. It sounds to me like you're saying "It's hard for me to earn lots of np because I only play games and the stock market, so I don't want anyone else to earn lots of np either." Sour grapes, anyone?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jan 17, 2005 10:41 pm 
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It would make a great deal of differnce, even if your the only one doing it.

That is the problem with this game. "Since everyone else is selling at 900,000 Np, I should too! Even though I bought it for 500NP at the Chocolate Shop..."

Who cares about 250NP? So be it you give someone the chance, you've given it to them, even if you lost a small 250NP over 10 Polarchucks = 2250. You can make that in a handful of games if you tried. I know I sucked at the games, untill i chose a handful, played them untill I was content in my scoring and then added more to my games. I could easily make 10-15k a day with seven games. Given I haven't as of late since my stocks are all up in the 50's currently.

It's the players who are being had into things by the "players". We want to have fun, "players" want to be mean (in the best possible explaination for me) to all others.

This is how it is. There are two different groups in this game now because of how one side has decided to do something to another. Forcing them to not enjoy their game anymore.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jan 17, 2005 10:53 pm 
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So you're saying we should kick all the restockers off the site? Look, it may not seem fair, but when everyone is overcharging an item, it's not going to help putting it at a lower price. In fact, that's foolish! If you don't like how restockers work here, you REALLY won't like how currupt CEO's in the real world work. Neopets is a lot like life in some cases, and you have to get used to it. You also appear to be IGNORING the lgoic everyone is telling you: supply and demand. I'm not going to tell you about it, considering 3 posts with it are already up, but really, actually READ and THINK about what they have posted.

And on a personal opinion, you said you neve cared about her quests until her avatar came out? Well, isn't all this fuss a bit much since it's over just a little avvie? :P


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 17, 2005 10:55 pm 
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I'm not going to get into all of this but there is one thing I would like to say: I restock only, and I am not as good as most people, but most of the time I do rake in about 20k per restock for profits. I price my items accordingly to that of the market. If I set my prices 5k below what the others are selling, the first person to see my item will quickly buy it up, and resell it in their shop for 5k+, like atomicblonde said. If what you say is true Slime, then if I were to say price my Krawk Trans Potion for 99,999 Nps, a handful of people would do the same?

Although I do agree with you that it is getting harder and harder to earn nps. More page refreshes = more money for np and more time spent on the site, which I try to limit as it wastes my time on a daily basis. I would agree to increase the amount of restocks instead of limiting them. That way prices would drop a bit and things would be more tangible when doing quests. Ive only done about 3 SF quests in the past months, and they were all under 3k. Got junk twice, and a pink ice cream coupon the third time.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jan 17, 2005 11:01 pm 
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Slime Lord wrote:
That is the problem with this game. "Since everyone else is selling at 900,000 Np, I should too! Even though I bought it for 500NP at the Chocolate Shop..."


That's the problem sentence right there. You're failing to even acknowledge that the economics of the situation has any effect whatsoever. There's three basic assumptions that explain what happens quite simply and in a free market (such as Neo) are always true.
1. There's competition.
2. There does exist an equlibrium where quantity demanded=quantity supplied. THIS is what sets market prices. Not "greedy" or "price gouging" people (or so you call them).
3. There's a free market mechanism that pushes towards equlibrium. When demand is greater than supply (this case) prices go up and vice versa.

Unless you want to turn neopets into some kind of socialist system these 3 assumptions will govern all market activities. The only way this could be even partially fixed is if items in the quest rarity range is increased minimum by 7-10 or more every time the item stocks.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 17, 2005 11:08 pm 
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Quote:
Anyone has the option to restock. If you want to earn more np, that's what you have to do, because playing games doesn't offer anywhere near the same amount of revenue. Don't condemn the people who DO do it, there's nothing wrong with it. It sounds to me like you're saying "It's hard for me to earn lots of np because I only play games and the stock market, so I don't want anyone else to earn lots of np either." Sour grapes, anyone?


Your quiet wrong on this one. I'm quiet content earing my 10-15k a day playing games alone. I was quiet content before Restockers, like your self, decided you all would go with the people who want to raise prices (and of course succed and because Price Gauging.) on the smallest of items, such as a Milk Chocolate Techo that was selling for under 500NP just three months ago and suddenly is in the thousands, along with dozens and dozens of other items. But this dosen't effect you since your the one doing it, and can afford it, while we players are effected the most.

Quote:
And on a personal opinion, you said you neve cared about her quests until her avatar came out? Well, isn't all this fuss a bit much since it's over just a little avvie?


Quote me on that and I'll get back to you, considering I don't care for Avatars what so ever and am more interested in the fun of the quest. Not to mention haven't once said anything about an avatar before now.

Quote:
If what you say is true Slime, then if I were to say price my Krawk Trans Potion for 99,999 Nps, a handful of people would do the same?


MP's, Paint Brushs, Battleweapons are all understandable in my book. They have always (most anyways) have been higher. They're the items many of us should gawk at and work for. Selling at that low would likely turn you a profit if you radnomly found it. But like anyone I would sell that for a decent price.

I understand that more refreshed means more money for TNT. Fine. But for the "players" taking the bait and letting prices get so high is ridiculous. The "Players" are the ones who all rush in to the stores before anyone else can, even we who have High-Speed Net, can get to it and stand a decent chance amongest the others. They are the ones who set prices and you all "players" are getting out of hand with this and causing price gauges on many of the items you restock. I know the demand is high for many items, but that is because players want to have fun, while "players" take advantage of the situations infront of them.

Sorry if I'm ticking anyone else off, but this is how it is. My opinion. If you don't like it I'm sorry. But one thing I've noticed so far, maybe all but one of the posters here do not restock. The only repliers are restockers. Hmm

Edit:
Quote:
Unless you want to turn neopets into some kind of socialist system these 3 assumptions will govern all market activities. The only way this could be even partially fixed is if items in the quest rarity range is increased minimum by 7-10 or more every time the item stocks.


I most certainly want to see that happen because I would be very content once more, like many players, and I would feel that it is once more an even playing field with out two seperate groups. That is one of the reasons I am expression my opinion, hoping others feel the same and partially hoping Adam or another "powerful" TNT memeber sees this, reads this, and tries to do something about it.


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Last edited by Witch King on Mon Jan 17, 2005 11:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 17, 2005 11:08 pm 
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The economy isn't there to specifically benefit you. The prices are high because there are people willing to pay it. Why don't you yell at those people that are willing to dish out so much NP on quest items? If no one was willing to pay it, then prices would naturally fall.

Quote:
Your quiet wrong on this one. I'm quiet content earing my 10-15k a day playing games alone.


It's not the restockers' fault you're unwilling to keep up with the game.

And what's all this about "players"? So restockers aren't real players? They're (we're, I am a restocker that also plays games) sub-players? :roll:


Don't be afraid to see the truth, even if no one wants you to. Be yourself and not a fool. Don't ever be afraid to speak your mind and listen to criticism. Dissent is keeps our country progressive and willingness to challenge yourself is what keeps yourself ever evolving.


Last edited by SpiraLethe on Mon Jan 17, 2005 11:12 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 17, 2005 11:09 pm 
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Erm, No, Slime. Just...No.
I spent 8 hours total on Friday Restocking.
I had to beat many other people to the decent restocks.
I don't think you fully understand how many people are restocking in the same shops.
If I grab something rare, i'm not lowering my prices one bit, and shouldn't be told to.
I work hard for what I have. I always did.
Don't imply that people that "Just" restock aren't true players of the game.
It's harder than you think, i've been beaten out of so many expensive items I could scream.
Not to mention the people that are complete idiots, and use ABers.
I know there are things i've seen restock that were grabbed by autobuyers.
It aggravates me to no end, but I keep at it.
I refresh for hours, and I buy what I can get.
It's no different than working hard on games to get neopoints.
People whine because they can't restock.
I'm sorry, I feel your pain. I couldn't either for the longest time.
I will NOT, however, lower the prices of my items for their benefit.
If I can make 200K a day from restocks, then I'll do it.
I don't CARE if some people have a problem with it.
If you don't like the prices, don't buy the items.
I'm so sick and tired of people saying how easy it is to restock.
Especially those who don't do it on a regular basis.


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